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Max Mus
Nov 23
Hello everyone!
I really need help from the SG community. I have a feeling that I'm marking time in my mixing learning process. It just drives me crazy and depresses me.

Friends, advise a book or a course that will tell about the concept of mixing, the sequence of tasks in this process. Not just tips and tricks, but something like Mike Senior's book "Mixing Secrets for the small studio".

I also have big problems with reverberation. If without it, then I can make a clean mix, without frequency conflicts, well panned and so on. But when I start adding reverb, everything turns into a mess. I've already watched a lot of videos on this subject, but reverberation remains for me what destroys my mixes.
Maybe it's problem in my Yamaha HS8 (but I work in room with good acoustic and also with Sonarworks Reference 4). Maybe it's hard to do it on cheap monitors?
But most likely the problem is my mixing skills and I want to understand how to work with reverb properly.

Many thanks to everyone who will not pass by and give advice.
Good day to everyone.
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Hello Max, I took a course "Art of Mixing" at Point Blank online music school. It has online tutorials (pre-recorded) as well as weekly live masterclasses from great teachers and bi-weekly 30min 1-to-1 sessions with them. It is well structured like you need and exactly this structure helped me so so much in mixing my music. Check their website for schedule / cost.
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Mikael Nyblom
Nov 23
Hello Max. First of all, I highly recommend that you take the Mix & Mastering course here at SoundGym. There's a ton of things to learn there and I found it highly useful.

Here are some general pointers, without having heard any of your songs or knowing your genre(s):
* Add reveb as a send (i.e. route to the Master bus), and not as an insert.
* Try using delay instead of reverb. Works well e.g. for vocals in dense mixes.
* Adding a pre-delay to the reverb will make the sound of the source more defined.
* Try to match the decay of the reverb with the tempo of the song.
* Be careful with using reverb on a kick drum, unless there's a lot of room in the mix and/or you really want that huge sound for it (think "I Love It Loud" by Kiss).
* Rolling off low end on the reverb can make it less muddy. Rolling off top end will decrease disturbing sibilance.

Don't know if this can be of any help, as you have already mentioned that you've watched several videos on the subject. The best thing would probably be to take one of your mixes to Mix Critiques for (friendly) dissection. :)
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Max Mus
Nov 23
Dima Shipitsyn, thank you. I'm already thinking about buying some course, but I will be able to do it only in a couple month.
I looked at the point blank website, it looks interesting. Thank you so much for prompting, I've never heard of them before.
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Max Mus
Nov 23
Mikael Nyblom, thank you for reverb tips. As I wrote, I know them in theory, but when I'm trying to use it in practice... it's like a woodpecker flying into a house of cards. )
But for the hint about the course, special thanks! Hope it will be helpful. I'll start watching it today.
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EJ Gaub
Nov 23
Hi Max,
You started off by probably saying the most important thing....you seem to like your mixes without reverb. The golden rule of any mix is that you have to like it first and above all. So the first question to ask is "does my mix need reverb?"
If the answer is yes, then ask yourself what instruments or components need reverb and what are you hoping to gain in your mix by adding it. Adding any kind of eq, compression, or effect blindly or because there was a click bait YOUTUBE video on how to get the most bomb ass vocal sound telling you this is the ONLY way to mix something is usually the fastest way to ruin your mix....and confidence.
What I would suggest is when you are sitting down to mix...load into your session a reference song that you really like that you feel could be included in the same playlist as the song you are mixing. Pay close attention to the use of reverb and other spacial effects in that mix....and check it against yours.
With any effect....a little goes a long way.
If you are applying a reverb or delay DIRECTLY to an audio track....make sure you use the WET/DRY knob to turn the wet down.
If you are setting up your reverb as an AUX Send and it will have its own bus.....then you can follow your reverb plugin with an EQ and filter out the lows and highs that you feel you do not need.
Mikael's comments are spot on...so no need to repeat those.
Hope this helps! Good Luck
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Tim
Nov 23
best reverb tip I ever got was the "Abbey Road" trick--extreme EQ/filtration on the reverb *send* signal. I use it live and in the studio and it really cleans up my mixes.
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Max Mus
Nov 23
EJ Gaub, thank you! Your comment is very valuable! Can I ask some additional questions if you don't mind?

Are you adding reverb during mixing in general or closer to the end of mix? Because I often read something like a post fixed in the head of this page. "adding compression, eq and so on, after adding reverb". But then I watch something like "mixing entire track" from Produce like a pro and he just add reverb during mixing.

And another question, how you choose what instrument will be with reverb and without it. I understand that it depends from music style and there's some obvious instruments like distant percussion hit with long verb tail in a mix. But I'm talking about instruments in the middle of imaginary space (not front and not distant).

And maybe you can recommend some article, tutorial or book about creating space or mixing process steps in general.

Thank you very much for your answer!
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Max Mus
Nov 23
Tim, Yes, I know, it could work fine for solo instruments. Thank you!
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Jake Kavanagh
Nov 23
If you can get your hands on a copy or pdf of Mixing With Your Mind by Michael Paul Stavrou it has a great insight into setting reverbs to fit your track. Packed full of practical methods to learn and implement the tools
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Max Mus
Nov 23
Jake Kavanagh, thank you! I heard about this book and forgot... It will be my next one to read.
Thank you!
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@Max Mus to be honest, if i am just starting out mixing a song, I try to pick a reference song first, so i got a guideline. There is no general guideline in terms of when you wanna add reverb/delay etc. I tend to start dry, getting the overall levels right, so i can hear everything the way i want. Keep in mind that you can emphasize quieter parts or parts you wanna push harder, later with automation. Than i will add EQ & Compression, as well as effects on certain Instruments, thus depending on the genre. At his point and prior to it you might switch back and forth to you reference Track and listen how much low-end/compression and reverb/delay does the Drums have, the Guitars and Vocals. You can listen how levels of the individual tracks are set comparing the Bass with the Kick/Drums as well as the amount of effects in general and might be able to pin point how much delay a vocal or guitar might have.

Surely you can add a bit of reverb to i.e. the vocals, if that is what might point you into the right direction when listening to a reference Song. Keep in mind that effects might blur sloppy edits or similar, which might be more audible listening to the track without effects. Other than that, all advices prior to this post will guide you just fine. Automating the FX Tracks probably will do the trick.

Oh and do not hesitate to share a track with us, where you might have trouble getting it to a point where you actually like what you did. ;)

PS: Your monitors should not be a problem, unless a unit is broken or somehow messed up.
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Max Mus
Nov 24
Christoph Ebel, thank you very much.)
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Rafael Lin
Nov 24
IMO, I use headphones to adjust reverb, they give more details than monitors. Also you can try some different types of reverb, or try to cut the freq <600hz and >10khz before sending into reverb.
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Vlad Po
Nov 24
Hey!
before you do reverb you need to understand how it should sound, where is this instrument? And then you will begin to better understand which reflections in the sound should be more and which less.

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Vlad Po
Nov 24
тебе лучше подойдет этот вариант)))
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Have you looked into equalising the reverb plugin itself this can really help as some reverbs have a low presence you can give this some air. Music tech guru is good for mixing guides and music tech help guy is also useful!
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John Kraft
Nov 24
there is a good (and free) training series right here in sound gym. Look under "Learn"
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EJ Gaub
Nov 24
Hi Max
For me, everything is completely dependent on what the goal for the mix is. You can often run into lots of problems when you get used to doing things only one way, or ALWAYS treating an instrument or the voice the same way. There are WAY too many factors that go into the sound of an instrument, how it was recorded, and the goal it serves in the mix to say...."I always EQ, or COMPRESS, or blah blah a kick drum this way or that way." Same would go with reverb and effects. Certain mix engineers or producers like having the dry vocal hit the ear before the reverb...if that is the case then have pre-delay would be a factor....some engineers or producers want a unique or heavily effected vocal sound....then we find usually several reverbs and effects of various lengths on the vocal or instrument to give lots of space or vibe.
If we are speaking about BASICS.....if feel a good way to get started would be to set up 4 different aux bus'......one try using a reverb plate anywhere from 2-4 secs, the second use a room reverb that is around 50-70 ms, then set up a delay bus that is an 1/8th note, and another that is a 1/4 note......and during your mix, try sending the voice or the instrument to each one of those GRADUALLY....and see if one of them is giving you the vibe you want....or maybe its a combination.....or maybe certain ones work for certain sections.....Once you have that part worked out.....then you can add an EQ behind each, and can roll off some of the bottom and top and see if that does anything constructive or destructive to your vibe.
It is all ear candy my friend......everything needs to serve the vision of the mix. IF you do not have a vision then you are just guessing or waiting for lightening to strike. Good luck!
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Ruud Reiher
Nov 24
I can recommend you the book: Modern Recording Techniques, from David Miles Huber... it is a very important and detailed book...
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Max Mus
Nov 24
Ruud Reiher, thank you! It's going to be my next one.) For me books are better way for getting professional information, rather than videos.
Thank you!
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Max Mus
Nov 24
EJ Gaub, thank you. I completely agree with you about a role of an instrument in each individual track, and not a template mixing.
Thanx for you detailed answer.)
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Max Mus
Nov 24
John Kraft,
Mikael Nyblom already told me about it and I'm goind to start one of them today or tomorrow.
Thank you!)
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Max Mus
Nov 24
Thomas Redmond, of course I'm using EQ on reverb channels.
Thank you for feedback!
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Max Mus
Nov 24
Vlad Po, спасибо, я инфу предпочитаю потреблять на исходном языке.
Видосы гляну.
Спасибо за совет!
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Max Mus
Nov 24
Thank all of you for help, bros!
Couple books and courses this is a sufficient amount of information to process.
Hope I'll find what I'm looking for during reading and watching.
I'm very grateful to all for responsiveness. Thanx again!